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Post by lebaneaver on Dec 30, 2023 19:28:03 GMT -8
Exactly. Smith (being a former QB, AND QB coach) NEVER developed a quarterback during his tenure here. Ever. Ironic. So who turned Luton from a JC transfer who pretty much sucked under Anderpants into a fringe NFL QB? Lindgren
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Dec 31, 2023 9:58:03 GMT -8
So who turned Luton from a JC transfer who pretty much sucked under Anderpants into a fringe NFL QB? Lindgren Luton only played 3 whole games under Andersen, and in 2 years under Smith/Lindgren his season completion percentage went 61.5% all the way up to an astronomical 62%. I’d think it’s possible they developed the overall offensive scheme a little more than they developed Luton.
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Post by sonoma beav on Dec 31, 2023 10:25:12 GMT -8
Luton had Hodgins.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Dec 31, 2023 10:54:55 GMT -8
So who turned Luton from a JC transfer who pretty much sucked under Anderpants into a fringe NFL QB? Lindgren So if Lindgren gets credit for turning Luton into a fringe NFL-quality product, then he also gets the blame for others who did not develop, right? Or in other words, Lindgren, as the OC, was responsible for QB development. Which means your complaint about "Smith not developing QBs" are groundless, because it wasn't his job to develop the QBs.
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Post by rgeorge on Dec 31, 2023 11:23:24 GMT -8
So if Lindgren gets credit for turning Luton into a fringe NFL-quality product, then he also gets the blame for others who did not develop, right? Or in other words, Lindgren, as the OC, was responsible for QB development. Which means your complaint about "Smith not developing QBs" are groundless, because it wasn't his job to develop the QBs. Smith basically hasn't done any on-field coaching since Idaho and his role was limited there. Smith is an X's/O's guy who now roams the field and kibitzes and gives "speeches". Any development, of any position wasn't Smith. It's why his staff moving with him was huge for him and why Bray getting GREAT teachers that players buy into is equally huge.
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Post by lebaneaver on Dec 31, 2023 12:49:08 GMT -8
So if Lindgren gets credit for turning Luton into a fringe NFL-quality product, then he also gets the blame for others who did not develop, right? Or in other words, Lindgren, as the OC, was responsible for QB development. Which means your complaint about "Smith not developing QBs" are groundless, because it wasn't his job to develop the QBs. Oh hell, Skrim.. you argue simply to argue. I really don’t give a damn what you “think.” js has done a s%#tty job of developing QBs, whether you agree, or not. I hope that trend continues.
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Post by rgeorge on Dec 31, 2023 13:01:19 GMT -8
So if Lindgren gets credit for turning Luton into a fringe NFL-quality product, then he also gets the blame for others who did not develop, right? Or in other words, Lindgren, as the OC, was responsible for QB development. Which means your complaint about "Smith not developing QBs" are groundless, because it wasn't his job to develop the QBs. Oh hell, Skrim.. you argue simply to argue. I really don’t give a damn what you “think.” js has done a s%#tty job of developing QBs, whether you agree, or not. I hope that trend continues. Especially if you consider "developing" actually recruiting a kid and slowly working him into a starter. A transfer to play to get to that point. So I'd like to hear a name that JS/staff developed. His entire career was based on a JC or portal transfers. It may be the way of the world, but they never "developed" crap. Maybe Ben? But was a PT starter one year... Gebbia, Blount, Willard, Luton, Moore, Colletto, Chryst, Nolan, Vidlak, Noyer, Blair, Huchinson, Throckmorton, Montiel, DJU... Did I miss anyone that was a nicely developed QB since JS took over?
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Dec 31, 2023 17:08:24 GMT -8
So if Lindgren gets credit for turning Luton into a fringe NFL-quality product, then he also gets the blame for others who did not develop, right? Or in other words, Lindgren, as the OC, was responsible for QB development. Which means your complaint about "Smith not developing QBs" are groundless, because it wasn't his job to develop the QBs. Oh hell, Skrim.. you argue simply to argue. I really don’t give a damn what you “think.” js has done a s%#tty job of developing QBs, whether you agree, or not. I hope that trend continues. No, I'm saying that it's not the head coaches job to develop QBs, or the OL, or the DL, etc. He has myriad responsibilities, many of which have nothing to do whatsoever with the actual on-field product. Player development falls on his coaching staff, who can devote 100% of their time to doing just that.
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Post by bleedorange21 on Dec 31, 2023 17:36:42 GMT -8
Oh hell, Skrim.. you argue simply to argue. I really don’t give a damn what you “think.” js has done a s%#tty job of developing QBs, whether you agree, or not. I hope that trend continues. No, I'm saying that it's not the head coaches job to develop QBs, or the OL, or the DL, etc. He has myriad responsibilities, many of which have nothing to do whatsoever with the actual on-field product. Player development falls on his coaching staff, who can devote 100% of their time to doing just that. True but he was a qb and that’s where most of his knowledge is so he could easily get more involved there if he thought the development was lacking. Or he could’ve realigned the coaching staff to have a separate qb only coach. Imagine how bad these QBs would’ve been without coach M’s lines.
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Post by bvrbred on Jan 2, 2024 10:06:20 GMT -8
Why would we change what got us here? New coaches = new system. Almost 100% of the time. Agree. And this is Gundy's first job as a coordinator. I would be amazed if Gundy tried to reinvent the wheel, running an offense he has never worked with before, at a new job. I don't believe Gundy has ever worked with Smith or Lindgren. My guess is Gundy will try to run something similar to what Chip Kelly has been doing lately. It is a run first balanced offense. The run blocking relies a lot of misdirection which might be a good idea if your offensive line is incapable of handling people straight up. This incoming QB Johnson looks like a good fit for doing the kinds of things Kelly was doing with DTR.
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Post by atownbeaver on Jan 2, 2024 10:24:01 GMT -8
New coaches = new system. Almost 100% of the time. Agree. And this is Gundy's first job as a coordinator. I would be amazed if Gundy tried to reinvent the wheel, running an offense he has never worked with before, at a new job. I don't believe Gundy has ever worked with Smith or Lindgren. My guess is Gundy will try to run something similar to what Chip Kelly has been doing lately. It is a run first balanced offense. The run blocking relies a lot of misdirection which might be a good idea if your offensive line is incapable of handling people straight up. This incoming QB Johnson looks like a good fit for doing the kinds of things Kelly was doing with DTR. This is a pretty good guess and one I agree with. I will note, there are rumors Gundy and Kelly were butting heads a bit on QB development and philosophy... But I think we see an RPO based run first offense. McCoy and Johnson are both that mold.
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Post by orangeattack on Jan 2, 2024 12:38:26 GMT -8
The one thing that I've always been impressed with Chris Petersen's teams (and now Kalin DeBoer at UW is continuing this) is heavy use of pre-snap shifts to expose the defense and create leverage.
I was hopeful that we would see a lot of this with Smith but that really didn't end up being the case. If there was an item I'd wish for as part of the offense, that's it. Boise State spread the ball out to a lot of different receivers while still managing to put together a potent running game. I think this is important to be able to run a balanced offense instead of a one-dimensional more gimmick type offense like the Air Raid.
I think there is also a measure of sense in a Lunchpail U, hardhat type of offense that focuses on running the ball. At least half the games are played in cold/wet/rainy conditions. Wide open offenses like Oregon runs require a depth of skill talent.
They're Muhammad Ali. Flash and style, talent abounds. They want to get you in space so they can embarrass you.
We're Joe Frazier. Hard headed, relentless, physical. We want to get you in a phone booth so we can take your soul.
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Post by NativeBeav on Jan 2, 2024 12:50:50 GMT -8
Oh hell, Skrim.. you argue simply to argue. I really don’t give a damn what you “think.” js has done a s%#tty job of developing QBs, whether you agree, or not. I hope that trend continues. No, I'm saying that it's not the head coaches job to develop QBs, or the OL, or the DL, etc. He has myriad responsibilities, many of which have nothing to do whatsoever with the actual on-field product. Player development falls on his coaching staff, who can devote 100% of their time to doing just that. And who is responsible for hiring/ firing the coaching staff? Whether he is responsible directly or indirectly - doesn't matter. All of the staff are an extension of the HC. The buck stops with who again?
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Jan 2, 2024 13:31:17 GMT -8
No, I'm saying that it's not the head coaches job to develop QBs, or the OL, or the DL, etc. He has myriad responsibilities, many of which have nothing to do whatsoever with the actual on-field product. Player development falls on his coaching staff, who can devote 100% of their time to doing just that. And who is responsible for hiring/ firing the coaching staff? Whether he is responsible directly or indirectly - doesn't matter. All of the staff are an extension of the HC. The buck stops with who again? The buck stops with the head coach. And I thought the head coach did a great freaking job turning the mess he inherited into a very competitive football team in a pretty short time. They must have developed somebody for us to rise from the GAG mess and win 5, 7, 10 and then 8 games in his final four full seasons. Not sure why you continue to diminish just how much this program improved under the coach who somehow couldn't develop any talent, or hire assistants who couldn't develop talent.
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Post by orangeattack on Jan 2, 2024 13:51:33 GMT -8
And who is responsible for hiring/ firing the coaching staff? Whether he is responsible directly or indirectly - doesn't matter. All of the staff are an extension of the HC. The buck stops with who again? The buck stops with the head coach. And I thought the head coach did a great freaking job turning the mess he inherited into a very competitive football team in a pretty short time. They must have developed somebody for us to rise from the GAG mess and win 5, 7, 10 and then 8 games in his final four full seasons. Not sure why you continue to diminish just how much this program improved under the coach who somehow couldn't develop any talent, or hire assistants who couldn't develop talent. Kind of neither here nor there but I feel like there is definitely a potential to ruin a QB with bad coaching but "developing" seems heavily dependent on the relative skill of the player, and the offensive system around the coach. I think there is far too much credit to coaching staffs given for "developing QB's", with few exceptions.
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