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Post by RenoBeaver on Oct 30, 2017 20:10:53 GMT -8
I tend to agree with you. Even the rare occasion he played good Ds in the Pac 12 his offense struggled. Not that I disagree with OA, Chip Kelly is a great college coach, but the SEC is not a good spot for Kelly.
Even as down as it is, the SEC has bigger, faster defenders, they just grow 'em that way in the south. And the success of his offense will still be premised on keeping his QB upright.
If its one or the other, Florida is the better fit. Tennessee is an awful fit. But I would not want to go coach in the SEC. It churns and burns coaches not named Saban. Even the ones that have success want out. It's the south, it's rabid fans who expect championships yesterday, it's rabid donors and boosters who expect the same. He's an outsider, not only a former "soft" Pac 12 coach, but a northerner to boot.
UCLA would be a better fit for him if he wants a high profile gig. ASU too but I think Graham keeps his job. The Big 10, Pac 10, even the ACC, which extends along the entire east coast. Chip Kelly in the SEC? Why would he want that?
Now, watch him be announced as head coach at Florida tomorrow.
BTW, for those here who say he has no personality. He's awesome on the set (forget what network he's on) discussing football. He simply gives no Fs about gladhanding people who feel they have to be close to the program. Unfortunately for him, that's an expectation at big schools.
His offense would hammer most SEC defenses. Elite defenses stymie all offenses not just Kelly’s We seem to think the elite SEC teams represent the norm whereas other conferences for some reason don’t get the same pass....I give you Vanderbilt for example LOL, so does Missouri's its 15th in the county at 487 ypg, 2nd in the SEC, and they are 0-4 in conference. Ole miss is 4th in the SEC at 461 ypg, they are 1-4 in conference.
So OK, I'll concede, his offense would probably hammer most SEC defenses. The problem is you aren't winning the SEC because you have a high flying offense. At least not like you do in say, the Pac 12.
I'm a big Chip Kelly fan, I think he is a great coach. I just don't think he does well in the SEC. Specifically what I mean by that is he won't come remotely close to the same success as he did at Oregon. In fact, I'd be willing to bet he never wins the conference there as long as Nick Saban is at Bama, and quite frankly, I think he'd going to struggle to win the SEC east, Kirby Smart is building Bama East, maybe has built it.
If he goes to UCLA? I think he wins the Pac 12 south within 2 years.
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Post by orangeattack on Oct 30, 2017 21:14:23 GMT -8
this a million times, but to that end - the way to defeat the spread option is to have DL that the OL can't block hat-on-hat. Hence my repeated stated concerns with Gary coming in and announcing he would be installing a spread option type of offense.. we don't get OL that win mano y mano battles. The success we have had has come from scheme, not winning the head to head battles in the trenches (Exhibit A, Mike Remmers and Quizz vs USC) Actually Kelly’s offense doesn’t go hat on hat or at least the zone read. Leave a guy unblocked. That’s who you read. Not always the backside defender. This allows an olinan to get to the second level. Eliminating a pursuer and creating longer running play. What slow the offense is when the defense has discipline to not over pursue when unblocked. However this slows a pass rush In fact leave their best lineman unblocked and read him. Also since it’s zome blocking the online can take the defender where he wants to go. The offensive line doesn’t have to outmatch the Dline head up "Kelly's offense" is kind of a misnomer that we all keep using - just as a general acknowledgement. Chip Kelly wasn't teaching the reach block technique for 85% of the plays when he was coaching for the Niners or the Eagles. What we are really talking about is the basis of the zone read which is a basic concept that we were using heavily in this offense in the ill-fated Anderpants Era. So with that out of the way, when I say "hat on hat" I'm not talking about schematically. I'm referring to the fact that the zone read as Oregon was using it especially did not utilize a lot of combination blocks. In other words, everybody was expected to get a hat on a hat and get numbers on the edge. Which you allude to by leaving the backside defender (though not always) unblocked to create the read - that's the tactic to use with the guy you can't block mano y mano. Oregon tried the approach of leaving the best lineman unblocked the first year Paea played them - Banker took him and put him at zero tech (head up with the center) and told him to bullrush every play the second year and Paea made a mess of the mesh point all game long, mostly by depositing the center ass first into the middle of it. What I was pointing out was that this is in stark contrast to the teamwork aspect and complex combination blocks and handoffs that happen in a pro-style offense. This scheme makes it harder to produce explosive plays that the zone-read offense but it's also less prone to failure because you can hide deficiencies with scheme.
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Post by beavadelic on Oct 30, 2017 21:23:29 GMT -8
Zero doubt he's a good coach. He's a great coach. But the facts are that SEC front 7's neutralized his offense, even with the remarkable Mariota. That's all. Zero disrespect intended, unless we're talking about his ill fitting suit on tv! I tend to agree with you. Even the rare occasion he played good Ds in the Pac 12 his offense struggled. Not that I disagree with OA, Chip Kelly is a great college coach, but the SEC is not a good spot for Kelly.
Even as down as it is, the SEC has bigger, faster defenders, they just grow 'em that way in the south. And the success of his offense will still be premised on keeping his QB upright.
If its one or the other, Florida is the better fit. Tennessee is an awful fit. But I would not want to go coach in the SEC. It churns and burns coaches not named Saban. Even the ones that have success want out. It's the south, it's rabid fans who expect championships yesterday, it's rabid donors and boosters who expect the same. He's an outsider, not only a former "soft" Pac 12 coach, but a northerner to boot.
UCLA would be a better fit for him if he wants a high profile gig. ASU too but I think Graham keeps his job. The Big 10, Pac 10, even the ACC, which extends along the entire east coast. Chip Kelly in the SEC? Why would he want that?
Now, watch him be announced as head coach at Florida tomorrow.
BTW, for those here who say he has no personality. He's awesome on the set (forget what network he's on) discussing football. He simply gives no Fs about gladhanding people who feel they have to be close to the program. Unfortunately for him, that's an expectation at big schools.
I agree about UCLA. If he ends up coaching there, with that amazing talent in his backyard, he will be a major thorn in everyone’s butt. USC should get him, but they probably will hang onto Helton. The rich talent there is undisciplined and therefore wasted.
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Post by obf on Oct 31, 2017 10:09:51 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2017 10:48:43 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. Nick Saban says hi....
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Post by bennyorange on Oct 31, 2017 11:34:42 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. What about Dennis Erickson? Unless you don't credit him with the Beavers rise to the Fiesta Bowl team, which I consider to be part Riley part Erickson, he managed to pull it off twice. Of course he didn't stick around long either....
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Post by NativeBeav on Oct 31, 2017 12:22:15 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. This - spot on
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Post by obf on Oct 31, 2017 12:32:05 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. Nick Saban says hi.... Ehhhhhh..... I forgot about that one magical season at LSU.... otherwise his other coaching stops and the rest of his time at LSU was meh... But sure, Urban Meyer and Saban, there you go, incredibly rare it is
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Post by obf on Oct 31, 2017 12:34:42 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. What about Dennis Erickson? Unless you don't credit him with the Beavers rise to the Fiesta Bowl team, which I consider to be part Riley part Erickson, he managed to pull it off twice. Of course he didn't stick around long either.... As much as I loved Dennis and the 2001 season.... no, Dennis doesn't count. He didn't really build either miami or OSU, inherited both... All though he kept them both going... 2001 was an outlier as well, he didn't really build us up into an upper echelon team...
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Oct 31, 2017 13:14:55 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. Nick Saban says hi.... I don't get the Urban Meyer comment... he's only "gotten" one team into the upper echelon of the college ranks. That was Utah, and that was impressive. The other two he basically inherited. Both have been powerhouses for a long time. Saban managed to have 5 average seasons and 1 good season in the Big 10 and parlay that good season to take over a team that had been just two years removed from consecutive SE Conference regional 1st place finishes. He did rebuild them a bit, then got to take over a formerly bigtime program in Alabama that had fallen into less glorius days. I'd have to give Saban the edge over Meyer on turn arounds. I can't fathom how anyone can equate taking over at Ohio State, LSU, Florida or Alabama to the job as anything similar to what the next coach has here at Oregon State. Those two coaches had it easy in comparison.
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Post by nforkbeav on Oct 31, 2017 14:44:21 GMT -8
ck doesn't like to recruit, or deal with boosters.
Why would he want to coach college again considering he doesn't like two of the main job requirements of a college head coach?
From a logical perspective, if he were to coach college football again it would need to be a program that easily draws talent and has an AD who's willing to cover for him with boosters. It would also need to be in a conference that doesn't have multiple power football teams which he struggled to beat. OU, Texas, Miami, Florida, LSU, maybe Auburn, UCLA would be the most likely from a talent standpoint.
In actuality, if it's the system you're after, Rich Rod seems to run/coach it better. 2-1 vs sdtr since joining the P12.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Oct 31, 2017 15:07:21 GMT -8
ck doesn't like to recruit, or deal with boosters. Why would he want to coach college again considering he doesn't like two of the main job requirements of a college head coach? From a logical perspective, if he were to coach college football again it would need to be a program that easily draws talent and has an AD who's willing to cover for him with boosters. It would also need to be in a conference that doesn't have multiple power football teams which he struggled to beat. OU, Texas, Miami, Florida, LSU, maybe Auburn, UCLA would be the most likely from a talent standpoint. In actuality, if it's the system you're after, Rich Rod seems to run/coach it better. 2-1 vs sdtr since joining the P12. Why would any college want to hire a head coach who has gone on record as 1) Doesn't like to recruit 2) Doesn't like to deal with boosters 2) Doesn't lke to deal with the NCAA... I'm pretty sure all three were stated when he first interviewed for a Pro job... AND not only has run afowl of the NCAA, but was one of only 3 NCAA head football coaches in history to have a show cause sanction against him? Chip is making 6 million a year still off of his San Francisco contract for a couple years, and he's got a cushy gig in front of the camera for ESPN. It wouldn't surprise me if he's done with college ball.
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Post by spudbeaver on Oct 31, 2017 16:24:25 GMT -8
ck doesn't like to recruit, or deal with boosters. Why would he want to coach college again considering he doesn't like two of the main job requirements of a college head coach? From a logical perspective, if he were to coach college football again it would need to be a program that easily draws talent and has an AD who's willing to cover for him with boosters. It would also need to be in a conference that doesn't have multiple power football teams which he struggled to beat. OU, Texas, Miami, Florida, LSU, maybe Auburn, UCLA would be the most likely from a talent standpoint. In actuality, if it's the system you're after, Rich Rod seems to run/coach it better. 2-1 vs sdtr since joining the P12. Why would any college want to hire a head coach who has gone on record as 1) Doesn't like to recruit 2) Doesn't like to deal with boosters 2) Doesn't lke to deal with the NCAA... I'm pretty sure all three were stated when he first interviewed for a Pro job... AND not only has run afowl of the NCAA, but was one of only 3 NCAA head football coaches in history to have a show cause sanction against him? Chip is making 6 million a year still off of his San Francisco contract for a couple years, and he's got a cushy gig in front of the camera for ESPN. It wouldn't surprise me if he's done with college ball. With all that dough you'd think he could pull in a better fitting suit.
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Post by orangeattack on Nov 1, 2017 10:48:53 GMT -8
It won't happen... but I would chuckle pretty hard if Chip Kelly ended up the next coach at Nebraska. Not because I wish for MR's demise, quite the opposite, but just because I would find it funny to see the once mighty cornhuskers go to the old state of Oregon coaches bin twice in a row It also wouldn't surprise me if the Chipster never again ascended to the heights he once achieved, regardless of which school he ends up at. Not because I think he won't be cheating again, but just because it is incredibly rare to see a coach have great success, and build a program up twice in his career... Urban Meyer is the only guy who I can think of that has gotten two different college teams (three if you count his Utah team that ended up ranked #4) to the upper echelon of the college ranks. Most coaches that are truly dominant for a short time like Chip was (and shorter term like St. Dennis) they are catching a bit of lightning in a bottle. Playing the historically dominant programs when they are at a 30 year low, soft early schedules, a weak and cash-poor Pac-10 that was playing second fiddle to even the Big 10 and Big 12 during the 90's... let alone SEC.. even ACC to some extent was further up the food chain. Now I'd argue that the Pac12 can be compared favorably to everything short of maybe the SEC still. USC and UW are back. Oregon has become a contender all on the national level. The landscape was right for Chip to succeed at Oregon. It changed almost immediately after he left and the opportunity isn't the same now. If he found just the right spot you might see it again but man talk about the planets aligning.
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