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Post by RenoBeaver on Jun 2, 2020 21:50:12 GMT -8
And that's 105,000 with shutting the country down for 2.5 months. It could have been much worse. As for the actual # of dead, there are annual death statistics that will give a far better indication of how many deaths should be attributed to CV19. Yale already has a study out and I think they concluded the real # was 15% to 20% higher. Of course, Americans hate them some science based data. Because their cousin is friends with a lady married to a doctor who says its likely maybe a hoax. Uh-Huh. Or they read conflicting data from respected organizations that contradict other, or even their own earlier data. But go ahead and keep insinuating that anybody with a different view is an uneducated hillbilly. It seems to make that crowd feel better. Lol..indeed overwhelming does allow for a minority "conflicting". Climate change, vacinations, trickle down economics, flat earthers, the moon landing. I could go on. Im sure someone will find a reason to dismiss the death count data too. It's so confusing, except when its not. Also interesting you went the uneducated hillbilly route. Because I know a ton of people who think Covid 19 is a hoax, none of which I'd label an uneducated hillbilly. Maybe a few, but that would be a badge of honor to them.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Jun 2, 2020 22:03:49 GMT -8
Most reputable health-care experts believe the true death toll to be considerably higher. And Dr. Birx lost much of her credibility standing silently by while someone advocated drinking bleach, taking lupus medicine or inserting IV light into their bodies to kill the virus. People die of many causes. Dying of a heart attack, old age or car crash is something completely different than being killed by a virus you caught simply by attending a party with an infected person (for example) (and 35,000 people per month do not perish in automobile crashes, and the population of the US is about 340 million, not 3.4 billion). I am getting on with my life. I do take precautions. I might attend a football game this fall, given the opportunity. But I certainly do not discount or attempt to rationalize the staggering toll this virus has taken on our country, as some appear to have. By the way, not that Trump knew this but UV blood irradiation was used as treatment back in the 40s and 50s, but he may have been aware Cedars-Sinai is and was actively researching UV-A light catheter treatment for Covid inside the body at the time of his statement. Studies are still being done on the hydroxychloroquine associated treatments. The bleach thing was just dumb though. 2 out of 3 are actually being studied.
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Post by ag87 on Jun 2, 2020 22:06:06 GMT -8
How about people with underlying conditions stay away from the public areas and only see people they know and trust. Can the rest of us have a life? Please and thank you. What I hate are handicap parking spaces and ramps. Hell, I can climb stairs so obviously all those ramps are stupid and just some liberal ploy to annoy the good people in my country. And the spaces close to the store? Crud, I'd have a life if they weren't reserved for gimps.
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Post by pitbeavs on Jun 2, 2020 22:15:16 GMT -8
ATown, please explain to Dr. Einstein, the concept of flattening a medical demand curve. Please? Outside of NYC, NJ, IL, MA, PA and MI where has the "medical demand curve" needed true flattening?
BTW, he disagreed with your earlier assertion of easily tracing down to pinpoint provable exposure location, genius.
P.S. Flattening the curve already happened over a month ago. Wanna move the goal posts some more? Second wave! Third wave! The sky will fall if we don't stay locked-down, you just watch!
"BTW, he disagreed with your earlier assertion of easily tracing down to pinpoint provable exposure location... " No he didn't. He said it wasn't cost effective. And he's right ... unless of course you're an enterprising plaintiff attorney on a class action suit wanting to either (1) increase punitive damages or (2) force the defendants to settle quickly.
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Post by pitbeavs on Jun 2, 2020 22:16:46 GMT -8
Most reputable health-care experts believe the true death toll to be considerably higher. And Dr. Birx lost much of her credibility standing silently by while someone advocated drinking bleach, taking lupus medicine or inserting IV light into their bodies to kill the virus. People die of many causes. Dying of a heart attack, old age or car crash is something completely different than being killed by a virus you caught simply by attending a party with an infected person (for example) (and 35,000 people per month do not perish in automobile crashes, and the population of the US is about 340 million, not 3.4 billion). I am getting on with my life. I do take precautions. I might attend a football game this fall, given the opportunity. But I certainly do not discount or attempt to rationalize the staggering toll this virus has taken on our country, as some appear to have. By the way, not that Trump knew this but UV blood irradiation was used as treatment back in the 40s and 50s, but he may have been aware Cedars-Sinai is and was actively researching UV-A light catheter treatment for Covid inside the body at the time of his statement. Studies are still being done on the hydroxychloroquine associated treatments. The bleach thing was just dumb though. 2 out of 3 are actually being studied. Hydroxychloroquine has been rejected. The data isn't there to justify further study.
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Post by pitbeavs on Jun 2, 2020 22:18:39 GMT -8
How about people with underlying conditions stay away from the public areas and only see people they know and trust. Can the rest of us have a life? Please and thank you. What I hate are handicap parking spaces and ramps. Hell, I can climb stairs so obviously all those ramps are stupid and just some liberal ploy to annoy the good people in my country. And the spaces close to the store? Crud, I'd have a life if they weren't reserved for gimps. I could run your over with my car and qualify you. That H-word is a bad word.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Jun 2, 2020 22:36:02 GMT -8
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Post by alwaysorange on Jun 2, 2020 22:36:53 GMT -8
How about people with underlying conditions stay away from the public areas and only see people they know and trust. Can the rest of us have a life? Please and thank you. What I hate are handicap parking spaces and ramps. Hell, I can climb stairs so obviously all those ramps are stupid and just some liberal ploy to annoy the good people in my country. And the spaces close to the store? Crud, I'd have a life if they weren't reserved for gimps. That was a bad analogy,. Parking spaces for the disabled aren't keeping me and millions of others from enjoying life. Unreasonable and unworkable precautions and guidelines are. I just returned from Arizona practically no one including seniors wear a mask. Its really quite amazing.
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Post by pitbeavs on Jun 2, 2020 22:43:24 GMT -8
I stand corrected. Maybe. We'll have to look at better constructed studies. So the jury is still out.
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Post by pitbeavs on Jun 2, 2020 22:45:20 GMT -8
Hydroxychloroquine has been rejected. The data isn't there to justify further study. Wrong, again (as usual) ... dunce cap.
Oh look, he finally mastered google. But isn't it way past your bedtime, young man?
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Post by spudbeaver on Jun 3, 2020 7:27:18 GMT -8
How about people with underlying conditions stay away from the public areas and only see people they know and trust. Can the rest of us have a life? Please and thank you. What I hate are handicap parking spaces and ramps. Hell, I can climb stairs so obviously all those ramps are stupid and just some liberal ploy to annoy the good people in my country. And the spaces close to the store? Crud, I'd have a life if they weren't reserved for gimps. That's a really poor analogy in my opinion. In your attempt it is still possible to get to where you are going, it's just an inconvenience. Not so with the shutdown. Also, his point, while not presented in the best manner is worth discussing. What other outbreak has the US encountered when people who weren't sick were quarantined? Not polio, scarlet fever, measles, etc. In those cases only the sick, and the household of the sick were quarantined. Why the 180? Just an observation.
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Post by spudbeaver on Jun 3, 2020 7:29:16 GMT -8
What I hate are handicap parking spaces and ramps. Hell, I can climb stairs so obviously all those ramps are stupid and just some liberal ploy to annoy the good people in my country. And the spaces close to the store? Crud, I'd have a life if they weren't reserved for gimps. I could run your over with my car and qualify you. That H-word is a bad word. FYI, in the construction world, from design to plans to building, they are still called handicap ramps, handicap symbols, etc.
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Post by atownbeaver on Jun 3, 2020 7:42:31 GMT -8
Outside of NYC, NJ, IL, MA, PA and MI where has the "medical demand curve" needed true flattening?
BTW, he disagreed with your earlier assertion of easily tracing down to pinpoint provable exposure location, genius.
P.S. Flattening the curve already happened over a month ago. Wanna move the goal posts some more? Second wave! Third wave! The sky will fall if we don't stay locked-down, you just watch!
"BTW, he disagreed with your earlier assertion of easily tracing down to pinpoint provable exposure location... " No he didn't. He said it wasn't cost effective. And he's right ... unless of course you're an enterprising plaintiff attorney on a class action suit wanting to either (1) increase punitive damages or (2) force the defendants to settle quickly. Yes... you CAN absolutely fairly accurately track exposure locations. Can you do it beyond legal reasonable doubt and can you do with with reasonable money and resources? no. and legal reasonable doubt is key because judges and juries are not content experts and can be swayed by other fancy pants lawyers and experts.
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Post by ornggnawer on Jun 3, 2020 7:42:50 GMT -8
I could run your over with my car and qualify you. That H-word is a bad word. FYI, in the construction world, from design to plans to building, they are still called handicap ramps, handicap symbols, etc. I think he was talking about the hate word
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Post by atownbeaver on Jun 3, 2020 8:08:03 GMT -8
ATown, please explain to Dr. Einstein, the concept of flattening a medical demand curve. Please? Outside of NYC, NJ, IL, MA, PA and MI where has the "medical demand curve" needed true flattening?
BTW, he disagreed with your earlier assertion of easily tracing down to pinpoint provable exposure location, genius.
P.S. Flattening the curve already happened over a month ago. Wanna move the goal posts some more? Second wave! Third wave! The sky will fall if we don't stay locked-down, you just watch!
Oregon. Absolutely. if we didn't shut down, we 100% would of spilled over into the 1,000 bed temp facility we built. at OHA we were making plans to mobilize every ambulatory surgical center in the state to hold patients. First week of April was very, very close to the tipping point. We dodge a bullet big time here. Being on the downside of an epi curve does not invalidate the actions you took to get here. a slow reopening is appropriate. I am not a strong second wave believer, but it is entirely possible if some amount of caution is not used.
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