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Post by nabeav on Jul 22, 2019 7:54:27 GMT -8
I'll only disagree with the latter. Common sense and very little sleuthing showed it was never going to be a great hire, leery alone a HR. GAG had issues at every level of human/ player interactions and relationships. The abrupt departure of MR and initial excitement of a big time P5 coach's interest lead those in power to overlook or completely ignore(?) obvious signs of big problems. A more thorough yet very simple investigation of those surrounding the program should, would have, shown huge red flags. The GAG hire was a complete fiasco from the start, and a breakdown in the trust of leadership to run this "ship". 20/200 hindsight. I’d love to see any/all of your critical posts on the GA hire from around the time of the announcement. Looking back at the earliest posts on this board, this was the first post I could find where someone openly and directly blamed the coaching staff for what was happening. There was some displeasure with performance and someone posted something about it smelling fishy that Sitake and Andersen were hinting at players intentionally screwing up in games, but nothing directly saying they were the problem until this: bennyshouse.com/post/274baseba1111 sounded the alarm fairly soon after that: bennyshouse.com/post/326/threadAnd just to toot my own horn, here's where I predicted that football cratering would lead to the elimination of a sport (which turned out to be Swimming) in November of 2015: bennyshouse.com/post/1443/thread
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Post by orangeattack on Jul 22, 2019 8:13:46 GMT -8
20/200 hindsight. I’d love to see any/all of your critical posts on the GA hire from around the time of the announcement. Looking back at the earliest posts on this board, this was the first post I could find where someone openly and directly blamed the coaching staff for what was happening. There was some displeasure with performance and someone posted something about it smelling fishy that Sitake and Andersen were hinting at players intentionally screwing up in games, but nothing directly saying they were the problem until this: bennyshouse.com/post/274baseba1111 sounded the alarm fairly soon after that: bennyshouse.com/post/326/threadAnd just to toot my own horn, here's where I predicted that football cratering would lead to the elimination of a sport (which turned out to be Swimming) in November of 2015: bennyshouse.com/post/1443/threadI don't know why those links don't work for me, but I can't open them. Weird.
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Post by TheGlove on Jul 22, 2019 8:55:27 GMT -8
20/200 hindsight. I’d love to see any/all of your critical posts on the GA hire from around the time of the announcement. Looking back at the earliest posts on this board, this was the first post I could find where someone openly and directly blamed the coaching staff for what was happening. There was some displeasure with performance and someone posted something about it smelling fishy that Sitake and Andersen were hinting at players intentionally screwing up in games, but nothing directly saying they were the problem until this: bennyshouse.com/post/274baseba1111 sounded the alarm fairly soon after that: bennyshouse.com/post/326/threadAnd just to toot my own horn, here's where I predicted that football cratering would lead to the elimination of a sport (which turned out to be Swimming) in November of 2015: bennyshouse.com/post/1443/threadNice sleuthing.
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Post by obf on Jul 22, 2019 9:18:24 GMT -8
@werebeaver, FWIW (and no I am not willing to dig up 4 year old links) I distinctly remember thinking baseba1111 was a nimrod for not liking the GAG hire He wasn't the only one skeptical of that "Home run hire" where we "Stole a head coach from a top 10 team!". I'll admit that I was fully bamboozled, I thought it was a good hire. I can't think of any hire in any sport where we hired a BETTER TEAMS head coach away from them... Anyway, I can affirm that baseba1111 saw through it. I think nabeav was also early to the skepticism? Maybe atownbeaver as well? Edit: Nice work, nabeav, going back and finding some links! I certainly didn't want to slog through any of that drek
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Post by four2itus on Jul 22, 2019 9:43:18 GMT -8
@werebeaver, FWIW (and no I am not willing to dig up 4 year old links) I distinctly remember thinking baseba1111 was a nimrod for not liking the GAG hire He wasn't the only one skeptical of that "Home run hire" where we "Stole a head coach from a top 10 team!". I'll admit that I was fully bamboozled, I thought it was a good hire. I can't think of any hire in any sport where we hired a BETTER TEAMS head coach away from them... Anyway, I can affirm that baseba1111 saw through it. I think nabeav was also early to the skepticism? Maybe atownbeaver as well? Edit: Nice work, nabeav , going back and finding some links! I certainly didn't want to slog through any of that drek I, embarrassingly, was a big boy panty supporter....far too long. This is how I feel about my actions now....
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Post by shelby on Jul 22, 2019 9:49:04 GMT -8
How about a shot at Chip Kelly? Too late now - but ? Think outside the box once in a blue moon. We always go predictable and cheap. It had worked ( amazingly in baseball and How about Dabo Sweeney ? Guys like that before everybody else knows about them. Seems to me, we hire a search firm (@$250K ), and we end up driving to Seattle to hire an ex Beaver footballer ( great one at that ), but with no head coaching experience. I will also say that credit can not be passed around to staff coaches. That is Chris Peterson. Where did someone dig Chip up ? Can’t we do the same type of ‘coach search ‘. Apparently not. Many people seem to be happy with all of this soft thinking and are willing to get excited about the possibilities. All I am saying is that we remain where we are because we have zero internal or external forces to go where we can. Like running a Company into the ground because no one can move off the ‘old school’ thinking.
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Post by Judge Smails on Jul 22, 2019 10:03:26 GMT -8
How about a shot at Chip Kelly? Too late now - but ? Think outside the box once in a blue moon. We always go predictable and cheap. It had worked ( amazingly in baseball and How about Dabo Sweeney ? Guys like that before everybody else knows about them. Seems to me, we hire a search firm (@$250K ), and we end up driving to Seattle to hire an ex Beaver footballer ( great one at that ), but with no head coaching experience. I will also say that credit can not be passed around to staff coaches. That is Chris Peterson. Where did someone dig Chip up ? Can’t we do the same type of ‘coach search ‘. Apparently not. Many people seem to be happy with all of this soft thinking and are willing to get excited about the possibilities. All I am saying is that we remain where we are because we have zero internal or external forces to go where we can. Like running a Company into the ground because no one can move off the ‘old school’ thinking. You post is full of contradictions. What head coaching job did Dabo Sweeney have before Clemson? Where was Chip a head coach before uo? You want to hire someone before everybody else knows about them. We just did. Also, it seems that Chip has lost his luster....we will see, but I wasn't too impressed with his first year at UCLA.
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Post by obf on Jul 22, 2019 10:07:10 GMT -8
How about a shot at Chip Kelly? Too late now - but ? Think outside the box once in a blue moon. We always go predictable and cheap. It had worked ( amazingly in baseball and How about Dabo Sweeney ? Guys like that before everybody else knows about them. Seems to me, we hire a search firm (@$250K ), and we end up driving to Seattle to hire an ex Beaver footballer ( great one at that ), but with no head coaching experience. I will also say that credit can not be passed around to staff coaches. That is Chris Peterson. Where did someone dig Chip up ? Can’t we do the same type of ‘coach search ‘. Apparently not. Many people seem to be happy with all of this soft thinking and are willing to get excited about the possibilities. All I am saying is that we remain where we are because we have zero internal or external forces to go where we can. Like running a Company into the ground because no one can move off the ‘old school’ thinking. In other words, you HAVE NO NAMES, that you would have actually liked to hire instead of Smith. You were asked for specific names that were around and avalible that were better than Smith that would have come to Corvallis, and you say Chip Kelly (surely you jest) and someone "like Dabo Swinney"?!?!?! Chip Kelly was never going to be accepted here, and it's not like he has had success anywhere other than Niketown, and the OSU parllels to Dabo would be Cory Hall (Dabo stepped in as interim HC after Tommy Bowden "retired") or, and how is this for irony, JONATHAN SMITH. Dabo played at Alabama with less sucess than JS, and then stuck to the SEC and worked his way up teh coaching ladders at bama and the Clemson, he was HOME GROWN, he was not some hot shot coordinator from another conference, he wasn't a big hire, he basically fell into the iterim HC role, and then they decided to keep him, iow, no "national search" at all... he wasn't ever the HC in waiting either, I am not a big SEC follower, but his hiring as the full time HC was met with a collective shrug, IIRC. Having watched a plethora of college and pro teams hire hotshots, and up and comers and big names and small names and unknowns and coordinators and comentators, etc, etc, etc. The one thread I see in it all is..... It is mostly a crap shoot, and time, place, situation, and a million other factors weigh way more heavily than the name or pedigree of the person hired. IMHO, Jonathan Smith IS the hot young coordinator that you are lusting for, with all the right connections, temperment, etc. to be successful in Corvallis, but because it FEELS like a ho hum hire (I guess because he is a former Beaver?) that you can't see that forrest for the trees. But, whatever, enjoy your couch.
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Post by green85 on Jul 22, 2019 11:23:24 GMT -8
How about a shot at Chip Kelly? Too late now - but ? Think outside the box once in a blue moon. We always go predictable and cheap. It had worked ( amazingly in baseball and How about Dabo Sweeney ? Guys like that before everybody else knows about them. Seems to me, we hire a search firm (@$250K ), and we end up driving to Seattle to hire an ex Beaver footballer ( great one at that ), but with no head coaching experience. I will also say that credit can not be passed around to staff coaches. That is Chris Peterson. Where did someone dig Chip up ? Can’t we do the same type of ‘coach search ‘. Apparently not. Many people seem to be happy with all of this soft thinking and are willing to get excited about the possibilities. All I am saying is that we remain where we are because we have zero internal or external forces to go where we can. Like running a Company into the ground because no one can move off the ‘old school’ thinking. In other words, you HAVE NO NAMES, that you would have actually liked to hire instead of Smith. You were asked for specific names that were around and avalible that were better than Smith that would have come to Corvallis, and you say Chip Kelly (surely you jest) and someone "like Dabo Swinney"?!?!?! Chip Kelly was never going to be accepted here, and it's not like he has had success anywhere other than Niketown, and the OSU parllels to Dabo would be Cory Hall (Dabo stepped in as interim HC after Tommy Bowden "retired") or, and how is this for irony, JONATHAN SMITH. Dabo played at Alabama with less sucess than JS, and then stuck to the SEC and worked his way up teh coaching ladders at bama and the Clemson, he was HOME GROWN, he was not some hot shot coordinator from another conference, he wasn't a big hire, he basically fell into the iterim HC role, and then they decided to keep him, iow, no "national search" at all... he wasn't ever the HC in waiting either, I am not a big SEC follower, but his hiring as the full time HC was met with a collective shrug, IIRC. Having watched a plethora of college and pro teams hire hotshots, and up and comers and big names and small names and unknowns and coordinators and comentators, etc, etc, etc. The one thread I see in it all is..... It is mostly a crap shoot, and time, place, situation, and a million other factors weigh way more heavily than the name or pedigree of the person hired. IMHO, Jonathan Smith IS the hot young coordinator that you are lusting for, with all the right connections, temperment, etc. to be successful in Corvallis, but because it FEELS like a ho hum hire (I guess because he is a former Beaver?) that you can't see that forrest for the trees. But, whatever, enjoy your couch. +1 The history on how Dabo Sweeney progressed seems very similar to Coach JS. Coach Smith knows what he walked into, and seems to pursue good results with enthusiasm. An assessment at this early stage (1-year+), I'd call the JS hire good for OSU. Some OSU fans will call it a great hire when JS takes the team to a bowl game in 2020.
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Post by NativeBeav on Jul 22, 2019 11:26:22 GMT -8
How about a shot at Chip Kelly? Too late now - but ? Think outside the box once in a blue moon. We always go predictable and cheap. It had worked ( amazingly in baseball and How about Dabo Sweeney ? Guys like that before everybody else knows about them. Seems to me, we hire a search firm (@$250K ), and we end up driving to Seattle to hire an ex Beaver footballer ( great one at that ), but with no head coaching experience. I will also say that credit can not be passed around to staff coaches. That is Chris Peterson. Where did someone dig Chip up ? Can’t we do the same type of ‘coach search ‘. Apparently not. Many people seem to be happy with all of this soft thinking and are willing to get excited about the possibilities. All I am saying is that we remain where we are because we have zero internal or external forces to go where we can. Like running a Company into the ground because no one can move off the ‘old school’ thinking. In other words, you HAVE NO NAMES, that you would have actually liked to hire instead of Smith. You were asked for specific names that were around and avalible that were better than Smith that would have come to Corvallis, and you say Chip Kelly (surely you jest) and someone "like Dabo Swinney"?!?!?! Chip Kelly was never going to be accepted here, and it's not like he has had success anywhere other than Niketown, and the OSU parllels to Dabo would be Cory Hall (Dabo stepped in as interim HC after Tommy Bowden "retired") or, and how is this for irony, JONATHAN SMITH. Dabo played at Alabama with less sucess than JS, and then stuck to the SEC and worked his way up teh coaching ladders at bama and the Clemson, he was HOME GROWN, he was not some hot shot coordinator from another conference, he wasn't a big hire, he basically fell into the iterim HC role, and then they decided to keep him, iow, no "national search" at all... he wasn't ever the HC in waiting either, I am not a big SEC follower, but his hiring as the full time HC was met with a collective shrug, IIRC. Having watched a plethora of college and pro teams hire hotshots, and up and comers and big names and small names and unknowns and coordinators and comentators, etc, etc, etc. The one thread I see in it all is..... It is mostly a crap shoot, and time, place, situation, and a million other factors weigh way more heavily than the name or pedigree of the person hired. IMHO, Jonathan Smith IS the hot young coordinator that you are lusting for, with all the right connections, temperment, etc. to be successful in Corvallis, but because it FEELS like a ho hum hire (I guess because he is a former Beaver?) that you can't see that forrest for the trees. But, whatever, enjoy your couch. Shelby, you reference UO going and getting a guy that was flying under the radar at a little known college (I believe in the NE?) and bringing him here. As OA has posted in the past, even if you have the best coach money can buy at any given time, it requires a number of other factors in order for them to be successful in - in essence, "lightning in a bottle". In addition to employing a new twist offensive scheme that had not been previously used, or at least not exactly like that, it took that plus a generational talent in Marcus Mariota to make it all work. AND he had to stay healthy! How many QB's did that "system" chew up and spit out? Many on here (and you) would have said before and just after the "GAG" hire that we had done exactly what you are suggesting - a known entity at HC - not a young, up and coming assistant. I would rather we take our chances hiring a hopefully up and coming future star HC with a great assistant coach pedigree, than a "homerun" HC hire that doesn't understand the culture at OSU, recruiting challenges, etc. - plus, he has a fire in the belly for OSU!
After only one season, it is way too early to be drawing conclusions about how the JS hire will play out. I like what I see in several areas, but the jury is still out. Point is, there isn't a panacea when hiring anyone for any organization, including the HC at OSU. Anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves.
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Post by beaver94 on Jul 22, 2019 11:46:11 GMT -8
Erickson was a gift. He was freshly fired, at a time few were hiring (most coaching changes are made well before LOI day, not after), and he was being paid big money by the Seahawks and came in willing to be one of the lower paid, if not the lowest paid, coaches in the league. You can’t compare his hire against ANY hire of an established coach we could have realistically made this time around. It’s tough to take anyone who throws out the Erickson hire as an example of what we can do seriously. And, the same people that say Riley is a failure/mediocre and praise Erickson for his one great year at OSU never talk about the rest of Erickson's career. Left OSU and failed again in the NFL and then had one good year out of 5 at ASU. It's not like his OSU teams after that 2000 year were anything special either. Outside of following up Jimmy Johnson at Miami and the first 2 seasons after Riley at OSU his career was pretty mediocre. There's no guarantee that any coach regardless of pedigree is going to succeed or maintain that success. Smith's resume is comparable to most of the SEC assistants that would have been available at the time.
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Post by shelby on Jul 22, 2019 12:10:18 GMT -8
Well, you can just enjoy yourselves with whatever floats your boat. I don’t need to put names out there - pay me $250K and I can find someone to help a school that does not seem to have a clue. I am not interested in reading your opinion and you are not interested in my opinion. So what ? I bet my football season will be more fun than yours.
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Post by spudbeaver on Jul 22, 2019 12:24:59 GMT -8
The failed coaching stockpile is littered with Chip Kelly stories that didn't pan out. For every Chipper there are a ton of failures. Chipper was coaching at New Hampshire for 10 years (10 years!) before someone noticed him. And he was never a head coach. Face it, the Ducks got lucky and with the combination of he, Uncle Phil, and a few athletic qb's that really fit his system, not to mention catching lightning in a bottle in Mariota.
Nobody on God's Green Earth knows whether Coach Smith will pan out to have the success of CK, or fail like the other 100 in the used coaching bin. Me? I like our chances with him.
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Post by spudbeaver on Jul 22, 2019 12:28:40 GMT -8
Well, you can just enjoy yourselves with whatever floats your boat. I don’t need to put names out there - pay me $250K and I can find someone to help a school that does not seem to have a clue. I am not interested in reading your opinion and you are not interested in my opinion. So what ? I bet my football season will be more fun than yours. Well, I agree with you on the dumb coaching searches. But the remainder of your post seems weird to me. I think the number of responses show that plenty of people are interested in your opinion. Just because most don't agree with you doesn't mean they aren't interested. And since you disagree with them, you aren't interested in what they have to say? Strange, but hey, it's a free country.
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Post by biggieorange on Jul 22, 2019 12:46:17 GMT -8
20/200 hindsight. I’d love to see any/all of your critical posts on the GA hire from around the time of the announcement. Looking back at the earliest posts on this board, this was the first post I could find where someone openly and directly blamed the coaching staff for what was happening. There was some displeasure with performance and someone posted something about it smelling fishy that Sitake and Andersen were hinting at players intentionally screwing up in games, but nothing directly saying they were the problem until this: bennyshouse.com/post/274baseba1111 sounded the alarm fairly soon after that: bennyshouse.com/post/326/threadAnd just to toot my own horn, here's where I predicted that football cratering would lead to the elimination of a sport (which turned out to be Swimming) in November of 2015: bennyshouse.com/post/1443/threadthis got me wondering what I was posting 3 years ago link
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